Posted by Disionity on 04.12.2015, 02:46 AM: Ghibli Films:Dubs VS Subs There is a fair divide between people who think Ghibli films are better in their English dubbed form and those who prefer them subtitled. Some say that the dubs are just as good as the original, while others say that the dubs are a mangled mess that change the meaning of the movie and are nowhere as good as the Japanese version. Having watched several Ghibli films in English dubbed form, I can say that the acting is usually excellent and the messages coherent, but how do they compare to the original Japanese scripts? Namely, do any of them have any signingant changes from the Japanese script that could alter how one receives the film's message? I've heard that the Pom Poko dub is pretty botched compared to original. |
Posted by saviour2012 on 04.12.2015, 05:46 AM: Disney dubs are preety good. And Hayao Miyazaki recommends his movies dubbed.
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Posted by Saddletank on 04.12.2015, 07:23 AM: This is one of those discussions that rarely ends well, like PC vs Mac ones.
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Posted by Disionity on 04.12.2015, 10:33 AM: Thank you for the replies. I know that Kiki and Castle In The Sky suffer from heavy "Americanization", but didn't know about the changes to Spirited Away. Would anyone mind filling me in on that? Also, are there any other notable movies that got changed during their dub? How do the dubs Ghibli makes themselves (Wind Rises, Kaguya) compare to the originals? |
Posted by Saddletank on 04.12.2015, 11:07 AM: The very end of the Spirited Away dub has a line spoken by Chihiro I recall that shows she remembers what occurred in the spirit world, and by definition implies strongly that she grew and developed as a person because of her experiences there.
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Posted by husky51 on 04.12.2015, 01:10 PM: When I watch anime, Ghibli or not, I always prefer the Japanese audio and English subtitles, ALWAYS!
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Posted by Disionity on 04.14.2015, 02:11 AM: I just watched Princess Mononoke with subtitles. The subtitled script is pretty much identical to the dub, with a few sentences altered. The notable difference being in the scene when Jigo and Ashitaka are having a conversation over a meal. In the dub, Jigo says, "My point is everybody dies, boy. Some now some later. From Emperor to brothel girl." and later goes on to say that the emperor has promised to give an entire hill of gold to anyone that can help him live forever. Whereas, in the subtitled version he just says he everybody dies and that "the important things do not get defeated by death". Out of curiosity, can someone tell me what that statement means exactly? What is Jigo refering to as "the most important things"? Is he talking about the gods? Perhaps the Emishi people? Or something else? |
Posted by Saddletank on 04.14.2015, 03:10 AM: I suppose he's saying something philosophical that the person hearing him needs to answer for themselves. The listener should decide what are the important things for them and by doing so examine both their own life and the lives of others around them as well as the wider world. In the context of this film (as in many other Miyazaki films) the wider world probably refers to man's impact on nature.
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Posted by saviour2012 on 04.14.2015, 08:33 AM: i think if you need detail of an outlook you read it not watch it. when you are watching something you are supposed to extract the detail from the surroundings of the movie.
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Posted by Disionity on 04.14.2015, 10:55 AM: By the way, did I miss something, or is it not really explained why Jigo wants the Forst Spirit's head in the subtitled version? |
Posted by Saddletank on 04.14.2015, 12:53 PM: You missed my point.
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Posted by Disionity on 04.14.2015, 01:58 PM: I apologize. I think I understand it now. It's quite interesting really. More or less he just threw that philosophy out there to see what one would make of it. You're saying that when one wants to know what that statement means, they must interpret and decide for themselves what's important, by examining themselves, the film, and the world around them. Perhaps Jigo is talking about the human spirit/condition, or maybe he's saying that the consequences of one's actions can't be undone by death. Jigo could be saying this to Ashitaka, as a character, to either share his wisdom, or to give a slightly encouraging message amoung all of the doom and gloom he just spurted out. Whereas in the dub they simply replaced it with a sentence that helps advance the plot. Either way, just wild and unintelligent speculation, on my end.
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Posted by Disionity on 04.16.2015, 08:49 AM: So, there are three sets of English subtitles for Princess Mononoke?
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Posted by Roarkiller on 04.20.2015, 10:59 AM: Strictly speaking, both are affected by a loss of "intended messages" because, hey, they're both English.
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Posted by Saddletank on 04.20.2015, 11:50 AM: Roar, there can easily be perfect translations since it is possible to convey the exact nuance across a different language. This is done professionally in very tight legal documents every day, cases where correct meaning is far more important than entertainment media.
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Posted by husky51 on 04.20.2015, 01:07 PM: Well put, Saddles, well put, indeed...
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Posted by Saddletank on 04.20.2015, 01:47 PM: Japanese honorifics are another source of subtitle difficulty. How do you translate "Miyazaki-san"? Is it "Mr. Miyazaki"? What then of the exact same honorific applied to his wife? The phrase is identical but this time "Miyazaki-san" can be translated "Mrs. Miyazaki". "Mr." and "Mrs." are not strictly correct in this case because "-san" is not gender-related, but we can infer that "Mrs. Miyazaki" is a slightly more formal or polite means of address than just "Miyazaki" because that same framework is present in English to an extent. The translating is easy enough, the nuances are there to trip the unwary.
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Posted by saviour2012 on 04.20.2015, 02:18 PM: although i do agree with your point that it is possible to make near perfect translation , it is not always better.
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Posted by husky51 on 04.20.2015, 04:51 PM: And that is just the honorific '-san'...
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Posted by Lynnie on 10.07.2015, 07:03 PM: I prefer watching dubs, especially for Ghibli films. The only Ghibli film I watched subbed was 'When Marnie Was There' and that was because I didn't want to wait....
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